New watch for me, and a huge thanks to Pete!

[z32turbo]

Wow well done. Congrats!!

[Archer]

Aug 2, 2014 7:33:11 GMT -6 ianmedium said:

Al, its a beauty. It has the best patina of the lume material I have seen. So even and consistent and that red really Pops.

I have a request though. I know your swamped and this might be a late night job for you but I would love to see (as I am sure everyone else would) a photo montage of the strip down and reassembly or even a video, that would be spectacular to see this beauty serviced.

I'll see what I can do mate.

Thanks again everyone!

Cheers, Al

[rxpete]

WOW!!! I don't know too much about Red Submariners, but that dial is the best example I've seen. I'm very jealous.
Congrats!!

[Archer]

So as you guys asked, I did take some photos as I serviced the Red Submariner I recently acquired. I’m not posting every photo, but this will give you an overview of what is involved and most of the major steps.

So here is a shot from before showing the starting point for this watch:



After removing the bracelet, and opening the case back, I removed the automatic winding system:





The movement is removed from the case, and I prepare to remove the hands:



This shot is just to show more of the true colour of the lume plots – depending on the lighting they are a nice tan, and can vary to a deeper mustard colour:



Dial is removed, and I disassemble the calendar and the winding/setting mechanism – I will skip some of the steps here:



Dial side is stripped:



Now to disassemble the wheel train side of the Cal. 1575:



Again skipping some steps and here everything has been removed, and the balance cock with the balance (jewels removed) is placed on the main plate for cleaning – this helps protect the balance during the cleaning cycle:



Note that the cap jewels for the escape wheel are also removed from the main plate and here from the wheel train bridge:



Automatic winding is disassembled:



Here the old mainspring can be seen in the barrel:



All the parts are sorted by function in this storage tray. Note that the hands, dial, and date indicator are all stored in containers to protect them during the service, and of course I do this with every watch I service:



Parts are loaded into baskets for cleaning:





After cleaning, the first thing I do is to lubricate and assemble the balance jewels, and then I check the balance spring for flatness, concentricity, etc. I do this with all other parts off the movement so I can see all the ay around the balance spring a bit easier – in this case the coils were not concentric so I had to do some tweaking:



Braking grease is applied in a thin stripe on the inside of the barrel wall:



A new mainspring is installed – I always replace the mainspring when I service a watch, because it is the engine of the watch and if it is not providing even torque to the movement, then all the tweaking in the world at the balance will not get you proper timing results:



Here the reversing wheels and escape wheel are ready for treatment with epilame (also called Fix-O-Drop), and this prevents lubrication from creeping away from where it is applied:



I also apply it to just the jewels on the pallet fork, and not to the entire fork as that can cause problems. I use a syringe filled with epilame to control the application to the jewels:



The base movement is assembled enough to get the watch ticking, and all the lubrication required has been done, with the exception of lubricating the escapement. I want this to run dry for a few minutes, and this will wear away some of the epilame on the pallet fork jewels, and this creates a spot where I will apply the lubrication:



Now I remove the balance and apply the 9415 pallet fork lubrication to the jewels – this is finer work and not easy to photograph without dragging out the macro lens and extension tubes. But the oil is placed in small drops on the small rectangular surface of the exit jewel. I apply a small drop and cycle the pallet back and forth until the jewel is dry so a little bit is carried away with each escape wheel tooth. I then apply a bit more, and repeat this until the escape wheel has made one revolution:



I assemble/lubricate the automatic winding system:



Looking at the case, it’s not bad but a few marks on the crystal:



I didn’t get really aggressive with this since it was in good shape, but here it’s better for sure:



So here I have run the watch through the first set of positional checks at full wind, and over 6 positions:



Now this watch has been serviced at least once, and for the most part whoever did the work seemed to be quite good. Unlike a lot of these watches I service, the plates, bridges, and screw heads were not all hacked up, so someone did take some care with the service. However it seems they fell down a bit when it came to the timekeeping. At the red arrow below you can see the Delta reading, and this is the difference between the fastest and slowest position – it is large at over 52 seconds, so this watch needs some serious timing work:



There is clearly a poise error, so this means there is a heavy spot on the balance wheel, and I use a process called dynamic poising to identify the location of this error and eliminate it. This involves taking some detailed reading in 8 vertical positions, with the balance amplitude at a reduced level – here are the first 6 readings:



My timing machine will only take 6 readings at a time, so the screen is reset and here are the last 2:



The idea here is that the lower balance amplitude will accentuate the errors, and this will help me identify the heavy spot on the balance wheel. I make a small chart of the readings in order to make it easier to analyze:



I now place the balance on my balance tack, and I use a screw head cutter to remove material from the wheel at the heavy spot – this can also be done by adding weight if you prefer, so adding timing washers to the screw that is opposite the heavy spot. Now this is a delicate process, and you don’t want to remove too much material, so I do this in small steps:



This is a time consuming thing to do, but the good part is that most of the time is spent checking timing again between taking a bit of material off, so I do work on other watches in the shop while I’m doing this. So many checks and small adjustments later, I am at a point where I am happy with the result:



The Delta number has been reduced from 52.6 seconds, to only 6.1 seconds. To put this into some perspective, on the most common brand I work on, Omega allows up to 12 seconds of Delta measured over 5 positions, and here I have about 1/2 that measured over 6, so this is a good result:



Here pressing on the sweep seconds drive wheel using my Horia jewelling tool:





Calendar is now assembled:



Dial is installed:



I select the correct runners for my hand press:



Hour and minute hands installed, making sure they line up and that the date change is within tolerance:



Pressing on the sweep seconds hand:



The case is cleaned and the movement is installed in the case:



Automatic winding is installed:



Looks good:



Now here is a video of me doing a final check on the date change – looks pretty good:

And I wore it on a NATO strap for a bit, and then put the bracelet on. I have tried a few times to get a good shot of the dial patina, but it is not easy!







So hope you enjoyed seeing the watch serviced.

Cheers, Al

[rxpete]

Cool! I didn't know vintage movements had so many anodized parts.

[ianmedium]

Al, thank you so much for doing this. Its fascinating to see the service done and the care and attention you take.

One question that occurred to me the other night about these vintage sub's and any other vintage dive style watch with an original water resistance rating suitable for diving or general swimming.

When serviced as you have done is the watch able to be used to swim or dive with as it was originally? Forgive me if this is a silly question but I just wondered? I know a lot of people say an older watches water resistance cannot be relied upon but I figure if all the seals are in place and nothing is worn it should be able to get back to being just as water resistant as when new.

[Baco Noir]

Nicely done Al and it looks stunning on both the NATO and the bracelet. Seeing the timing adjustment method was very interesting as well. Watching the date click over precisely at midnight was just icing on the cake. That's a real beauty Al.  

[Pete]

Great stuff Al!!

Fantastic to see no corrosion on the middle case under the caseback.
Also no obvious rust spots on the date disc too.

Be careful with that dial mate!
I get palpitations when I see these dials being handled lol

[Archer]

Aug 10, 2014 15:54:08 GMT -6 rxpete said:

Cool! I didn't know vintage movements had so many anodized parts.

Rolex has been using the anodized reversing wheels for a long time!

[Archer]

Aug 10, 2014 16:02:33 GMT -6 ianmedium said:

Al, thank you so much for doing this. Its fascinating to see the service done and the care and attention you take.

One question that occurred to me the other night about these vintage sub's and any other vintage dive style watch with an original water resistance rating suitable for diving or general swimming.

When serviced as you have done is the watch able to be used to swim or dive with as it was originally? Forgive me if this is a silly question but I just wondered? I know a lot of people say an older watches water resistance cannot be relied upon but I figure if all the seals are in place and nothing is worn it should be able to get back to being just as water resistant as when new.

I have not pressure tested this watch yet, but I will at some point. I don't intend to take this watch into the water or get it wet, even if it does pass the testing - the risk is just not worth it.  That is likely why many people talk about not relying on it, because the risk to the watch is just too great if it's a valuable vintage watch.

But to answer your question more generally, the answer is "it depends".  Really the case condition is the deciding factor on any watch, not just a dive watch.  Let's look at another Rolex I serviced recently: 

The pitting on this case would prevent it from sealing, even if all the seals were new (I replaced them all anyway at the request of the owner to try to get it to seal, but it would not).  So if the case is in good condition, and all the seals are replaced, there really is no reason why the watch could not have some water resistance.  I suspect the 1680 would pass if I installed new seals in the case tube and crown, as I have already installed a new case back gasket.  The case has no pitting at all.

Sometimes lack of water resistance is a choice made by the watch owner.  For example I service a lot of Speedmasters, and many of them are valuable vintage Cal. 321 models with original case parts.  In some cases these watches could be sealed, but the owners prefer not to change the parts on the watch that might allow it to seal, because the modern parts are not exactly the same as the vintage parts are.  They prefer the originality over water resistance.  Omega would never agree to that, but I do this often.

Cheers, Al

[Archer]

Aug 11, 2014 2:25:55 GMT -6 Pete said:

Great stuff Al!!

Fantastic to see no corrosion on the middle case under the caseback.
Also no obvious rust spots on the date disc too.

Be careful with that dial mate!
I get palpitations when I see these dials being handled lol

Well, I will admit that although I do handle "irreplaceable dials" quite often (again mostly on Speedmasters), this one did make me a little nervous.  It was just sooooo perfect that if anything happened it would have made me sick to my stomach I'm sure.

But steady hands are a requirement in this job, so not a problem mate.

And yes the case is in great shape, and the date disk was basically perfect.  Hard to see in the photos but it has a very nice grain to the silver background.

[ianmedium]

Thanks Al. As always you shine a light into the cobwebs of my horological mind and make it clear. Your pictures completely show why some are not now. I had never thought of pitting on Stainless Steel. I could understand it on my Timex's as they are on the whole chrome plated brass and sweat can play havoc with that.

I would have thought SS though would not have suffered from that problem, especially what are meant to be high grades of the stuff used by the Swiss. Would this pitting be mechanical or chemical in nature on the one you show?

[Archer]

It's pitting from corrosion, so not mechanical wear. Stainless steel is certainly not impervious to corrosion - I suspect this is 304 used back then, so the resistance to corrosion depends a lot on the specific grade of steel used.

Cheers, Al

[ianmedium]

Thanks Al, I had no idea Stainless was susceptible to corrosion, I always thought the clue was in the name! I wonder if thats why Rolex went to a higher grade?

[urtossen]

Congrats . . . .great